Channel 5 Vine row erupts as Malone fiercely defends St George's Cross amid NHS staff claims flag creates 'no-go areas'

According to a new survey, Black and Asian staff were left feeling “deliberately intimidated” as a result of the flags that were put up in many parts of England during the summer.

One of the trust's leaders said specifically: "I have been into homes with people who have been convicted of sex offences, and we go in and provide care to them.

"It can be a really precarious situation, and they [the nurses] handle that absolutely brilliantly. The autonomy and the clinical decisions that they make within that, I think, are fantastic. We saw during the time when the St George's flags went up, our staff, who are a large minority of black and Asian staff, felt deliberately intimidated.

"It felt like the flags were up, creating no-go zones. That's what it felt like to them."

The findings have been met with scepticism by many who have argued that there is no need for people to feel threatened upon seeing the symbol. And Ms Malone was one making that point.

"The reason there’s been an upsurge in the national flag is because, in this multicultural country that we now live in, many English British people are made to feel that our culture is divisive, that it’s offensive to people," Ms Malone told Jeremy Vine and fellow guest Gavin Ramjaun during Wednesday's Jeremy Vine.

She explained: "And so the upsurge in the flags is not to do with immigration — it’s to do with British people being told that their culture is offensive to other people.

"You know, I heard someone who was a migrant to this country saying that they feel uncomfortable walking down the street wearing the St. George’s flags.

"I’m sorry, it’s really weird to hear a migrant who chooses to come to this country, then say he is frightened of the emblem of this country. If you’re frightened of the emblem of this country…"

Mr Vine interrupted to suggest some feel there is a "loaded" implication behind flying the flag, to which Ms Malone insisted: "It’s not loaded."

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A post shared by Jeremy, Storm and Vanessa On 5 (@jeremyvineon5)

"Let Gavin answer, is it loaded?" Mr Vine asked, to which Mr Ramjaun replied: "For some, it is, because it’s a direct response to the threat of the values of what being British is.

"And a lot of people are scared by that. They’re scared of being, you know, taken over by migrants-" Mr Ramjaun went on, only for Ms Malone to intervene.

"Why would you be uneasy about people getting upset about the erosion of British values? Why would that upset you? You’re a Brit. You were born here. Why would that upset you?" she asked.

Mr Ramjaun replied: "It doesn’t upset me. I just feel the vibe change — that it’s less welcoming to be in certain areas of the country where recent flags have popped up from certain people who feel a certain way."

"Would you feel uneasy about the Palestinian flag?" Ms Malone probed, to which Mr Ramjaun admitted: "I would do, because, again, it’s one of those situations. I mean, that’s a different issue completely, but it’s—"

Ms Malone interjected once again: "It’s not, actually. It’s not, because the Palestinian flag is supposed to signify the Palestinian cause.

"But we all know it’s a symbol for Jews. It’s a symbol of hatred. And we all know it’s waved on these marches to frighten Jews and to scare."

Mr Vine attempted to intervene to bring the conversation back towards the St George's Cross, but Ms Malone stood firm and insisted her point was relevant.

"But it’s true... I think the St. George’s flag represents working people. I think it’s really representative of sports events, particularly football events!"

The debate sparked quite the reaction among Channel 5 viewers at home, many of whom took to social media to share their thoughts on Ms Malone's stance, in particular.

Reacting to a clip of the debate on Facebook, one viewer typed: "Try going to the U S.A. a country that has been multi cultural for years. The stars and stripes are proudly flown on flagpole in many gardens and that's the way it should be here with the flag of St.George."

A second weighed in: "It’s always the English flag. We don’t have any problems with our flag in Wales and I’m sure other parts of the country are the same. I don’t understand why English people have always been shamed for flying their flag."

"Carol is correct," added a third. "We're being made to feel unwanted in our own country, flying the flag shows that we won't be, and it's patriotic."

Meanwhile, a fourth echoed: "I don’t understand it either. When I visit another country, I like to see their national flag flying."

"If people are offended or intimidated by the flag of the country they are in, then why are they in that country in the first place?" a fifth questioned before a sixth weighed in: "When is it wrong to fly YOUR countries flag? If you have a problem with it, it's YOUR problem not the problem of the flag flyer. Live your life, stop trying to live and run the people's life you don't know."

However, some disagreed with Ms Malone's point of view. "The ppl putting these flags up are the exact reason its seen as divisive if you speak to them and hear their uninclusive views," one critics argued.

"I'm intimidated by the Palestinian flags."

"Why are they not taken down?"

📞 Amy from London says there is a level of scrutiny applied to the St. George's flag that isn't applied to other flags.@thecarolemalone | @GavinROfficial | @theJeremyVine | #JeremyVine pic.twitter.com/pBn1CY0TGQ

— Jeremy, Storm & Vanessa On 5 (@JeremyVineOn5) November 12, 2025

And a second suggested: "Anyone with half a brain knows why flags are now everywhere and it's not patriotism. Where were they last year?" (sic)

Ms Malone isn't the only familiar face to speak out in defence of the St George's Cross following the NHS trust boss's findings.

The People's Channel's very own Patrick Christys called the entire saga "ridiculous", adding: "The NHS doesn’t have a problem with some flags - they painted the entire side of one hospital with the pride flag. They’ve even got big LGBT Ambulances."

In his column about the survey's findings, he even pointed out: "NHS Staff are suing the NHS over their right to wear the Palestine flag at work."